LifeLines

General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: Laughing Penguin on March 12, 2019, 08:01:59 PM

Title: Swimming/Drowning mechanics?
Post by: Laughing Penguin on March 12, 2019, 08:01:59 PM
In our upcoming session the Takers will likely need to spend some time underwater in the hull of a capsized ship. So I was wondering if anyone had rules they liked involving swimming and potentially drowning should there be, say. something really awful in the water that might make it hard to go back up for air in a timely fashion? I didn't remember seeing any rules around so was looking at what would be reasonable in-game.

I was thinking maybe they could hold their breath equal to something like STR + Resistance? Then after that take stun to the chest each round until they can get a breath, after which the clock restarts. Maybe really strenuous activity that round reduces that amount of time by a round (or is that too harsh)?

Was there some other rule out there I should be looking at instead, or is this a good start for a discussion?
Title: Re: Swimming/Drowning mechanics?
Post by: Askew on March 13, 2019, 01:04:49 AM
STR+Resist if you’re feeling generous, just Resist if not. Clock resets if they get a chance to breathe but the stun definitely remains.

Remember, you are the Market, and the Market has no mercy.
Title: Re: Swimming/Drowning mechanics?
Post by: Askew on March 13, 2019, 01:07:37 AM
Or make a Resistance check, on success you can hold your breath equal to the natural black, can spend rations.
Title: Re: Swimming/Drowning mechanics?
Post by: Laughing Penguin on March 13, 2019, 01:42:43 PM
Remember, you are the Market, and the Market has no mercy.

I don't really buy into the adversarial GM mindset, even for a game like Red Markets. Portray the world as harsh and don't pull punches, sure, but but don't go out looking to punish anyone for playing in your game. Strict but fair, ya know?
Title: Re: Swimming/Drowning mechanics?
Post by: Dadalos on March 14, 2019, 11:55:34 PM
STR+Resist if you’re feeling generous, just Resist if not. Clock resets if they get a chance to breathe but the stun definitely remains.

sounds to me like a good spot to separate boom from bust, STR+ resist for boom | resist for bust.

though obviously This precludes them free-diving, if they have equipment (or some kind of specialization from a thing in their background)  then let them have it. make something else be the problem outside of the O2 if they cover that. millions of other things that can threaten them in the water XD.
Title: Re: Swimming/Drowning mechanics?
Post by: Askew on March 15, 2019, 12:53:03 AM
though obviously This precludes them free-diving, if they have equipment (or some kind of specialization from a thing in their background)  then let them have it. make something else be the problem outside of the O2 if they cover that. millions of other things that can threaten them in the water XD.

If they want to spend the bounty on equipment and pro dev, i’d say let them. It’s another thing to let them get themselves into trouble and every bounty spent elsewhere is one not going towards retirement goals.
Title: Re: Swimming/Drowning mechanics?
Post by: Askew on March 15, 2019, 02:21:13 AM
Remember, you are the Market, and the Market has no mercy.

I don't really buy into the adversarial GM mindset, even for a game like Red Markets. Portray the world as harsh and don't pull punches, sure, but but don't go out looking to punish anyone for playing in your game. Strict but fair, ya know?

That’s legit. I’m not really a adversarial GM to be honest, but in trying to think  that way I end up at the middle ground of “natural consequences for your actions”. I’m the guy on the FB group who had a player for an upcoming game who wanted to have a tank. So ok, you want a tank? Sure. But the consequences of the costs and upkeep are there plus how the world around you will respond fo that are things you’re going to have to deal with.
Title: Re: Swimming/Drowning mechanics?
Post by: CodeBlue on March 15, 2019, 10:07:56 AM
there's 'weird damage' rules for suffocation, that might help
Title: Re: Swimming/Drowning mechanics?
Post by: Diskhotep on March 15, 2019, 03:30:36 PM
Give them a "held breath" stress track with 10 charges. Every round underwater without surfacing they use one charge, with one additional charge spent whenever they perform an action which calls for an expenditure of rations (melee, heavy lifting, etc.).

You could then add a one-use SCUBA tank item (rechargeable if they can find and power a working compressor) that allows the Taker to spend charges from the tank instead of their held breath. Would also be useful for things like avoiding smoke inhalation damage or stuff like that.
Title: Re: Swimming/Drowning mechanics?
Post by: CodeBlue on March 16, 2019, 11:02:37 AM
so they burn 'breath' while underwater in addition to athletics?

Elegant!

+1 Bounty.
Title: Re: Swimming/Drowning mechanics?
Post by: Laughing Penguin on March 19, 2019, 07:42:21 PM
Give them a "held breath" stress track with 10 charges. Every round underwater without surfacing they use one charge, with one additional charge spent whenever they perform an action which calls for an expenditure of rations (melee, heavy lifting, etc.).

You could then add a one-use SCUBA tank item (rechargeable if they can find and power a working compressor) that allows the Taker to spend charges from the tank instead of their held breath. Would also be useful for things like avoiding smoke inhalation damage or stuff like that.

I really like this one... if I hadn't already started using my previous idea I would have definitely adopted this rule.

I did specifically call out a request if they wanted to take any other precautions before they rolled out, and they didn't take time to consider being underwater. So no breathing apparatus, no protection for their electronics (specs, flashlights, etc) for the ones diving, and OF COURSE they decided to try and enter the ship through the damaged hull underwater rather than try to get in through a door on the deck. After it occurred to them that boats had doors, they felt kind of silly, but by then we had 2 takers navigating a pitch black hold under water while counting rounds until they drown. Good times.

Score still unresolved, we broke for the night soon after they entered the ship, I can come back with updates if anyone is interested. =]
Title: Re: Swimming/Drowning mechanics?
Post by: Askew on March 26, 2019, 08:44:55 PM
I’d be interested in hearing how this ends up resolving.
Title: Re: Swimming/Drowning mechanics?
Post by: Laughing Penguin on May 15, 2019, 07:26:34 PM
I was on the boards and realized I never followed up on how this ended. So...

The Score was to salvage some bulk spices from a capsized cargo ship. The complications were a bunch of raiders in the area (river pirates are a thing in my game) who had a beef with local DHQS forces, and some sort of mutant underwater fish/creature. The legs heading in ended up being a lot more harsh than expected, with a scene where all but one player failed an important humanity roll resulting in multiple cracks and crumbles hitting the group before finding the ship. For some reason some of the group decided the best way to enter a half-sunken ship was to swim down and look at the hull breach that caused it to sink, not realizing until later that boats have doors. (To be honest, I thought that move was odd, but that they had some kind of plan in mind that didn't involve going in through more traditional means. They didn't.)

Originally we had a group of 5, 2 of which went underwater to enter the hold through the damaged hull, one which went full frontal assault on some raiders camping out on the ship's bridge, and two hanging back sniping away at the raiders. It was late so we wrapped the session here, but lost one of the underwater players due to a scheduling conflict. His character had just suffered a Crumble due a leg encounter gone wrong, so it was decided that he basically was too busy having a personal crisis to effectively contribute. The raiders were dealt with in a rather insane streak of good melee rolls and the ship was secure, but I did say they had to get the catatonic team member (the absent player) out of the darkened hold into safety.

Turns out that if you don't have Resistance, the drowning rules mentioned here are BRUTAL. Easily the most dangerous part of this Score considering they didn't take any precautions before hand.Players went into Killing damage from drowning pretty fast. From that point, a tough logistical challenge to get into the secondary hold where their cargo was, and the team mechanic came up with a clever way to open the bay doors rather than navigate the pitch black hold to allow them to go diving and haul up the buckets holding their prize.

Then came complication 2. An Aberrant I dubbed the Nautilus.

The concept was that a shipping container in the hold was smuggling people when it sank (props to the player who picked up on it without prompting) and one of them was infected. This would have resulted in a Ganglia normally, but the Blight doesn't transfer well in water, so to move from person to person the blight tendrills needed direct contact to spread, resulting in human chains of casualties stretching out from a central core. The casualties in the chain would grab onto a body allowing the blight to snake its way in and extend the chain. Multiple chains extended from the open cargo container throughout the water, and they were twitching. The main threat was again drowning, as being grabbed and held underwater was way more of a threat than any potential damage water-logged corpses could do - luckily the group Immune was the main diver.

Again credit to the players who called in their references to source some DDJs, and some lucky rolls later had the arms all cut off from the main core inside the container, allowing them to get as much bounty in goods as they could haul. Sure, the expense really ate into their profits, but it beat drowning, right?

Overall, a seriously brutal session.