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31
General Discussion / Re: "Margins and Dividends" Supplement Thread.
« Last post by VB3 on May 22, 2019, 03:58:33 AM »
+2 Bounty
32
General Discussion / Re: "Margins and Dividends" Supplement Thread.
« Last post by LordSkys on May 21, 2019, 11:50:46 PM »
Im interested, If you require a sounding board to workshop something Im online at least a few times each day.  ;),

an while my play groups not the most active, I have since developed quite a fondness for running solo games for myself to play-test character concepts and get a better feel for specific rules and how they interact.

+1 bounty for initiative.



Thanks Dadalos!

I'll admit, the majority of this supplement will be based around player use rather than Market use, so solo running will be interesting.

The supplement will most likely be broken into a few main sections, much like the official Red Markets book.

Most of the mechanics will be posted here or talked about on here, but the first play test sheet will most likely be stuff I have posted on previous threads.
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General Discussion / Re: "Margins and Dividends" Supplement Thread.
« Last post by Dadalos on May 21, 2019, 11:20:01 PM »
Im interested, If you require a sounding board to workshop something Im online at least a few times each day.  ;),

an while my play groups not the most active, I have since developed quite a fondness for running solo games for myself to play-test character concepts and get a better feel for specific rules and how they interact.

+1 bounty for initiative.

34
General Discussion / Re: "Margins and Dividends" Supplement Thread.
« Last post by LordSkys on May 21, 2019, 10:27:49 PM »
Current and Past Play Test Rules:

Current: V 1.0
-Coming Soon

Past:

V 1.0: Coming Soon
35
General Discussion / Re: "Margins and Dividends" Supplement Thread.
« Last post by LordSkys on May 21, 2019, 10:27:16 PM »
Current List of Play Test Material

V 1.0
New Tough Spots (18 new)
New Believer Sects (2 new)
Tough Spot Interpretations (1 new)
Boom/Bust Rules (2 new)
36
General Discussion / Re: "Margins and Dividends" Supplement Thread.
« Last post by LordSkys on May 21, 2019, 10:27:03 PM »
Current Outline of WIP Writing

Introduction
How to Use Margins and Dividends
Why Use Alternate Rules?
- Margins and Dividends in the Red Markets.
Canon and Red Markets
- Head and Design Canon
Boom and Bust Rules
The Story of Margins and Dividends
The Apostates
- From the Journals of the Apostates.

The Setting
The Loss
Discovered Enclaves
New Private Companies
Established Crews
Unknown Beliefs
New Abberants
A Shift in the Market
Optional Rules for the Setting
- How the Setting Changes

Takers
Tough Spots
How Did You Survive?
Tough Spots From a New Angle
-Interpretation Matters
New Tough Spots
- Setting Changing Tough Spots
37
General Discussion / "Margins and Dividends" Supplement Thread.
« Last post by LordSkys on May 21, 2019, 10:26:33 PM »
Hey All!

I've found time and time again that part of what makes Red Markets so dynamic is the fact that the Market shares thematic control of the story with the players. A Taker isn't just a character or plot point, but a Nexus that can shape the story into new paths. When it comes to railroading, Red Markets doesn't require it. Since the plot is directly affected by any action the Takers make, story telling becomes the main focus of the game.

Part of what makes the game so dynamic is it's mechanical looseness, and how it urges players to try new things because of how endlessly interpretable the mechanics are.

The addition of Boom and Bust rules allow for even greater playstyle customization.

So why such the flowery, "praise be to Caleb" introduction?

As already mentioned in my Tough Spot Supplement Homebrew thread, I have begun writing a supplement for Red Markets, which has a working title of Margins and Dividends.

The point (at least for me) isn't to create "more variety"; as much as it is to show how flexible the game really is, as well as putting out my work in a truly official style for the first time.


This supplement would focus mainly around three main ideas:

1)New player options of already established mechanics. E.g. Tough Spots, Will Points, Combat Maneuvers, etc.

2)Thematic variations for existing mechanics options. E.g. New Believer sects, different interpretations of tough spots in character, the aspects of the blight, major loss groups,etc.

3)Major mechanics that change the plot and story of the game and it's setting.


I have had brief email conversation with Caleb about the possible avenues of publishing, but I won't go into the hubbub right now. Safe to say, I know how I can and cannot put this work out there.

The next few posts will be reserved for thread set-up/general information, but after that this is an input/updates thread.

I will attempt to start to get Google docs of working rules out for people who wish to play test what is already written. A number of base mechanics introduced in the supplement are already written and require play testing. This play testing is a WIP on the part of me and the groups I work with, so input on the mechanics in play is always appreciated.

Feel free to PM or email me if you have questions, or even ask them down below.
38
General Discussion / Re: Throwing Grenades and Melee Weapons - What Skill?
« Last post by Dadalos on May 21, 2019, 06:42:13 PM »

Yeah. The shamble system does help with all that though. Since a shamble is just an inconsistent amount of movement, you can make the distance different for different combats.

We've always played it like this at our table, so idk if that is weird. Shambles are relative to the scene, and range along with it.

the shamble system being...intentionally vague hurts my group more hten helps so we tend to compromise(dont get me started on 'legs'...), its not a rigid '5 foot square' its more solid then : "its 'short' range" but it makes things weird for groups like mine that are strictly tactical tabletopers XD. that being said...using shambles relative to the scene might be the best way of describing it. long range in a office building would be different then long range in an abandoned parking lot.
39
General Discussion / Re: Tough Spot Supplement Homebrew
« Last post by LordSkys on May 21, 2019, 05:11:06 PM »
Just a quick update:

I have looked over the results from the poll, as well as talked it through with some of the players in my group.

There will be a new thread coming up soon for the supplement, and this one will be staying just a tough spot thread.

Thank you to everyone who posted so far, or have lurked here.
40
General Discussion / Re: Does Spray take a twitch action or not?
« Last post by LordSkys on May 21, 2019, 01:07:13 PM »
I think it is obvious that the two versions of Spray presented by the combat summary and page 287 are irreconcilable. The former clearly states it costs a twitch and three charges to activate spray, and the latter only requires spending three charges for a free attack. Thus, as most of you surmise, two versions have existed through development of the system, and remnants of both remain in the rule book. Going by the rules and examples, both seem likely candidates to have been the intended version. I favor the interpretation that page 287 is the correct one since it's the most fleshed out of the two.

However, what's more important is to consider the merits of the two versions, both thematically and mechanically.

Thematically
Requiring a twitch action to spray completely negates the theme of a weapon being able to spray out a lot of bullets, as even a lowly hand gun can make the same number of attacks as an LMG per round in this variant, that number of attacks being 2 for both weapons. The effect, when it requires a twitch, has very little to do with the idea of "spraying", but is more akin to a "quick shot", as it allows the second possible attack to be performed on the same initiative. I think that for this reason alone Spray shouldn't require a twitch to perform, but only the three charges (a large price already), as this conform to how Rifles and LMGs should work thematically: By spending tons of charges and going all out, they can deliver 4 attacks in a single round, as opposed to only 2 by the less potent weapons such as the hand gun or the slowly firing heavy rifle.

Mechanically
Spray requires a Twitch: In this version, spending three charges and a twitch accomplishes up to two things -
1. The second attack is done on your own initiative, and your don't have to declare Full Offensive before you start shooting. This benefit is situational, as it requires a combat scenario where the difference in initiative matters, which against stuff like casualties often won't be the case.
2. When not changing target (against humans), you get another automatic hit. This is arguably the main benefit of Spray, and even paying the extra twitch for it might be fine, but consider this: Without spray, you could spend those three charges (all spray weapons are charged) and get a +2 attack with your twitch. However, against humans, the upgrade in this version is actually silly when you change target: You have to roll to hit again for the second attack. In this case, it would probably often be better to just use 1 charge for a second attack on a later initiative, instead of using 3 charges.

By requiring a twitch to spray, it makes the hand gun almost as powerful as a rifle, despite the rifle costing more, requiring two hands (a major cost) and having extra upkeep. The costs of using these two weapons are vastly different, but in this version, both can lay down the same amount of fire power, the rifle just avoids splitting the attacks up initiative-wise. Yes, the spray on the rifle might grant a sure hit for 3 charges and a twitch, but that is not much different to just using 3 charges for 3 extra damage using the hand gun's automatic quality. Thus, even on the mechanical side of things I would argue for Spray not requiring a Twitch.

To surmise, I think that Spray not requiring a twitch action to activate is both mechanically and thematically the superior version.


I know I've been back and forth on the issue, but you put it best Khargan.

+1 bounty.
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